Category: Tune Trivia
So, while logged in here one day, I followed a discussion about music in general, and it struck me that in almost every user profile on here, people say that they enjoy listening to music, or making music, etc. etc., in other words, music plays a vital part in the lives of many users on here.
I then had the idea of launching a game show simular to Zone Icon, but something that (so I hoped) would attract attention from as many people as possible on here, since music is probably the one thing we all have in common.
And that's how Tune Trivia was born.
Among the things to come, is greater involvement from all of you.
What features would you like added to the show?
This category was created so that you could post anything relating to Tune Trivia on here, so, feel free to use it.
As for the audio mixing of the first show, poor Nick had a few technical difficulties when he completed the mix, but I'm 100% sure that as from next week on, the audio quality of the shows will improve dramatically.
So, let's have your thoughts and views on Tune Trivia.
Sorry, I don't have any helpful suggestions, I just wanted to post and say that Scott and Candi did a great job with the questions and sort of hosting the show. I won't complain about the too loud music because that's been done to death. Overall, the idea of the show is agreat and I hope it becomes an annual or semi-annual thing.
I guess maybe one suggestion for the future might be to try single categories. In other words, get people who love country music and let that be the only category and see who wins. Then get people who like old rock, hip hop, classical, etc. Just a thought.
Unfortunately i didn't have time to listen yesterday but i wish i did. It would be nice if the shows were available on demant as well or on cd to buy but last yeard this didn't happen for zone icon for copyright issues and i asume that it must be simmilar this year as well. If a user recorded the show perhaps they could send me a copy with sendspace or simmilar service or something.
Nikos, depending on what the rest of the staff says, we might make Tune Trivia available for download somewhere at some stage.
We haven't discussed it yet, but I like the idea, so I'll keep you posted on this one.
i like the idea too.
I personally found fromwhat I was able to listen to, that it became somewhat boring. I thought it might have been a bit better to vary the format a little, maybe if someone got a question right, that they then got the chance of a couple of bonus questions maybe, so that if they fell behind, there was a greater chance to catch up again.
To describe the production isues as nick having a few technical difficulties, is somewhat charitable, it's been acknowledged, he didn't even begin doing the work until the night before it was to be aired, therefore, he hadn't the time to fix any issues like we encountered. That to me seems both unprofessional, and somewhat arogant, to believe the job could be done like that.
Thanks a lot Q for bringing up my suggestion at the meating. Much appreshiated.
By the way i was reading this topick without being logged in to the site and i had the type your repply below and the box and everything but when i typed something and pressed send it said that i had to be logged in. In other boards this doesn't happen so i don't know if it is a bugg.
I'm not going to justify why I started the night before to anyone again, I've done it to death. Without going and revealing certain things from meetings and without totally damaging the PR of this project, I will abstain from comment. With that, I depart, and say that if you listen next Thursday, you will be pleasantly surprised. If you aren't, it's off with my damn head, willingly.
Signed,
A Nick who hates his own work about as much as you do.
Yes, having this available on demand somewhere would be awesome, as I'll be off at GDB getting a guide dog for the rest of the duration of tune trivia, unfortunatley.
I also like the idea of giving the contestants some way of catching up through bonus questions if they fall behind.
I bet the producers of zone icon wish they could have changed the day of their production mid term, so they had more time to do a better job. though it's lucky for us, they were professional enough from the start, and likely couldn't have done a better job in that respect.
yeah, agreed with kev about the catch up thing, it should have been more different and varied, some questions more than others and so on, it did get rather boring after a bit, considering it was just the same, it would have been interesting to see some people actually fight over who got to answer a question maybe instead of the purely turn based system.
I've not responded to this topic mostly out of laziness, but I figure I might as well get my chips thrown into the pile.
Overall, I honestly think that the first show could've been executed much better, both from an audio and performance aspect. I make my observations not out of any desire to cast disparity upon the project or its participants, but rather do so in an honest attempt to express my views on the program's execution, as well as any thoughts I might have on improving the format.
Firstly, I'd like to express my sincerest gratitude towards the staff and contestants of Tune Trivia. It's these little events that make the Zone a realized community, wherein various members are willing to invest a bit of time to provide entertainment for the rest of us. I know full well what kind of an undertaking such projects can and do turn out to be, so here's me hat off to all of you.
Audio:
A. I'm lead to understand that the general feel of the show should be that of an older game-show atmosphere. While I can admire this, I'm still not too sure about its practicality. If there are going to be periods of musical silence, perhaps certain background should be laid in to lend a studio-esque feel. Perhaps a very low-volume, faint, soft bed could be inserted during those times, to ensure the listener that he/she is still listening to the stream, and that it hasn't actually died.
B. As expressed by multiple people, the volume of the bed music versus the volumes of the contestants and hosts/staff are disconcertingly unbalanced. At times, the music is much, much too loud, drowning out the participants. Music should be far in the background, serving to set a mood, not to dominate it. All participants should be easily heard over the music -- no one should have to strain to hear any of the people on the show. Whether this is achieved by forcibly raising the participants' vocals via compression or whether the music is manually lowered, everything should be normalized afterwards.
C. I'm not sure how much this can be helped, but if it can be: Too much background noise from various participants is evident in the broadcast. While I understand this is a result of compression and normalization, I feel that various things could be done to improve this situation. In Candice's case, for example, she should try to use a headset during the recording sessions. Built-in laptop microphones are notorious for imparting a tremendous amount of mechanical noise into their recordings. If this situation can't be helped, perhaps capturing a clean noise print of a participant's ambiance as heard through VT would be beneficial in helping to eliminate these nuances. In either case, you don't want to damage the contestant/staff member's voice, but you also don't want to have them speaking over a jet engine.
D. Maybe it's just my personal preference for well-organized material with clear divisions, but I like a broadcast where people are panned out more. I wouldn't make the pan dramatic -- in fact, overly dramatic panning could potentially ruin the show, lending it an artificial feeling. I personally like the following VT setup: Hosts in dead center, one half of the contestants slightly to the left, the other half an equal distance to the right, and the score keepers either given a delayed stereo pan, or otherwise placing them in the center with the hosts. Spatial separations like this, at least in my opinion, give the show more body, more life. They let listeners clearly distinguish between contestants and hosts, and provides a quick and easy way to brighten the overall production.
Performance:
A. I honestly was hoping you guys would have a few bits where contestants would have to play Name-That-Tune. These name-that-tune questions could, for example, be worth more points. Aside from changing the pace of the show, I think this is sometimes just as challenging as answering trivia about particular performances. If this is done, though, I'd take clips of the song, play them through vt for people to guess, edit out those vt musical samples, and insert in the cleaner version of the clip.
B. If a certain person doesn't know the answer to a trivia question, the remaining players should be able to buzz in if they know the answer, rather than doing a "around-the-table" questionnaire. This eliminates everyone saying "I don't know", and gives the show a bit more of a competitive feeling. Architecturally, I'm sure people would have to key up and say me, or something. The first person to do so, of course, would get a crack at the question. These bits should then be edited out and replaced with actual buzz-in sounds. In cases where the hosts are unsure of who chimed in first, the score keepers would have the final say.
C. Along the lines of name-that-tune, perhaps have bits where players have to fill in the lines of a song (yes, singing is involved). Along with providing some potentially comical moments, these few detractions keep the show from stagnating. Mark may have disagreed with me last year during Zone Icon about this point, but I still stand firmly by my conviction that listeners want variety. You wouldn't want to turn on a soap opera to see the same kind of thing happen every day, nor would you want to watch a game show which didn't pose any change in tempo.
I may indeed have other views on the matter, but I'm at the moment rather deprived of sleep, so have probably forgotten them. I do disagree with Tyr's bonus questions idea, though. What's the point of trying to get ahead if other's can simply catch up with a few bonus questions? I think that if you implement name-that-tune and finish-this-chorus or whatever, and give these particular events differing point values, contestants will have plenty of chances to catch up.
And for the record: While I'm not enamoured with time changes in the middle of a broadcast, I'd much rather you guys do that then have everyone scramble around like chickens with their heads cut off in order to release a product. I'm only baffled as to why you guys didn't consider that earlier.
As to Zone Icon's strict schedule: We really had no room to switch whatsoever. Shows had to air on Tuesday so that people could vote. result shows had to be compiled Wednesday night to be aired on Thursday. People had to hear results on Thursday so that the winners, despite our repeated advice to pick a song before the results show in case they moved on, would have time to find one -- procrastinators, you all know who you bloody well are. Saturday .... record. I'm sure there would have been other ways of doing it, but we'd already decided on the format, and figured that it wouldn't be fair to the listeners to just hit the big red reset button.
Just my two yen.
Kai
First of all, thanks Kai for the constructive post.
There are most certainly areas in which we failed while taking on this project, but this altogether is a learning experience, and as has been said previously, we might consider holding such a game show in the future.
We'll definitely take with us the lessons learnt from this first series.
Also to Scott, I couldn't have said things better than you just did.
As for the next rounds starting next week, all I can say is that there will be a larger variety in questions, and hopefully the interaction between the contestants will be more competitive.
As for the rest of you, there will be some points up for grabs for you, as well as a surprise for a zoner towards the end of the show.
And it won't be just points.
Speaking on behalf of the now five man audio team, I'd like to make a few points.
you said, sure that if the audio team for icon, which BTW could in theory be easier to mix than TT, wanted Icon's timeslots to be moved, it would've been granted
.
Let's not go comparing icon and tune trivia. there each there own show. You can't sit there and say one is harder than the other. you weren't there to edit it. I was there with them when they were spending days and nights editing out all the buffers and blah blah blah. You thaught, just editing talking on vt was hard. Try editing singing and talking and judges and other stuff they added. You can definately tell a lot of hard work was put into it. Just llisten to the end result. Awesome sound, from the first show to the end ! you could hear all the people talking even through the bed music they had.
so yeah, people need to quit saying icon this or trivia this. There way different shows, leave it that way. you made a mistake from show one. You admitted this, which is a good thing, now move on and make the following shows much better. Chalk it up as a lesson learned. That's all you can do. it's the zone after all, your going to hear about it no matter what you do. So do your best, and that's all we can expect of you!
Let's keep the peace and not bring up icon this and tt that. it's just going to start more drama. we know the zone already has enough of that!
Shea
Shea, 'tis not drama comparing one show to the other. Or at least, those people who sit here on staff who make said points do not intend to cause drama, otherwise they would not be members of said staff. I had an opinion, and I voiced it, without intent to slight the Tune Trivia audio team, who I hold a hell of a lot of regard for.
oh my gosh. let's try this again. i hit alt s thinking i was in an email again. grr! hehehe
Anyway, if i can remember what i said. oh yeah,
Nic, I never once said you or the staff are trying to start drama. After
all
my
husband
is
on
the
staff!
smiles! I made a general statement, not only pointed at you! It's not how easy or hard work is. it's the end result that matters. Do your best and people will have to deal with that! That's all I was saying. Each show is it's own, and needs to be left that way.
Shea
The final production was a lot better this week, hwever in all honesty and I've heard others express this view, it really couldn' have been much worse.
However, a couple of points. All members on the show sounded like they were in the bathroom. In my opinion the echo did nothing to enhance the audio.
Having the contestants panned may have been a good thing, but was it really necesary to pan them so far that they nearly fall off the back of your shoulder if you wear headphones?
The contestants volumes were lower than that of both Scot and Candy, this making it difficult again for me being hard of hearing. I had to turn the volume up so I could hear the contestants, but then the presenters were loud, and i could even hear scot's headset looping other members of the team back. I know that is something difficult as scot is also hard of hearing, but my point is, to level out the volumes would help a great deal.
Lastly why Nick did you have 2 people panned to my left, youself Scott and Candy in the middle, and everyone else including about 4 members of the staff over on the Right. Q, for example would have been much better centrally for giving the scores as he was very low out to the side.
Kevin, Hard panning seems to be a Ventrilo thing, or at least, on this machine. Kai gave me some excellent feedback as to that, so we hopefully won't have panning this hard next time. As far as The placement of Quinton and co, In all honesty I don't know why I did that.
Re: Reverb, would've enhanced the audio some if the stereo field was narrower, which it will be next time, thank you again, Kai.